Kali Ma And Super Massive Black Holes.

2007 November 22
by Hazel

blam.jpg

Two streams of research have recently collided in my consciousness and its just so darn exciting!

I’ve been following the theme of cosmic influence throughout world myth. As described in Venusian Verses: My Muse Is Why; I have a sneaky suspicion that the earliest myths of humanity were recounting celestial theater, that the gods were planets, stars, and other spatial phenomena. It was only much later in time that those godly attributes were anthropomorphised and passed on to human beings, so called great men and hero’s, kings, priests, tribal leaders prophets etc.

On the other hand, I’ve been engaged in a personal study of the cosmos via the work of astronomers the world over. Armchair researcher, a phenomenon of the 21st century. What a luxury. Anyhoo…

First stream: Black Holes.

blackholeimagel138.jpg

Astronomers have determined black holes are not simply the devouring, sucking machines of matter they once thought they were. They have been able to measure, quantify and duplicate observations that show cosmic rays don’t come from all regions of the sky, they’re shot out from actively feeding supermassive black holes!

Cosmic Man!

Only a few short years ago, black holes were theoretical, and theoretically they were believed to be spots in space or rather “depressions” in space, sort of like the dent your butt makes sitting in that chair.

Rather than black, think invisible holes. We were unable to detect these depressions because they were thought to suck everything including light into themselves. What ever was sucked into a black hole was supposedly just snuffed out of creation. But now we know, the cauldron is leaky and she’s leaking cosmic rays!

Cosmic rays are possibly bombarding any planet within any galaxy thought to be powered by a black hole. The growing consensus is that more galaxy’s than not, house, no are powered by their own local or possibly even invading black hole.

Chandra Takes In The Bright Lights, Big City Of The Milky Way

The Milky Way galaxy has its own super massive black hole near the vicinity of the “Galactic Center” or Sagittarius A* So cool right? That’s why I’m filing this post under cool. What is cooler than black holes? I don’t know, I can’t think of anything more shrouded in mystery and rooted in science.

Our BH is as some say, starving.

Milky Way Monster Stars in Cosmic Reality Show

Black Hole at Milky Way’s Center is on Starvation Diet:

others call it resting

Heres a thought:

In contrary to ever hungry Black Holes,is that ,unlike black holes, wormholes have no event horizon. This means that things could go in a wormhole and come back again. In fact, theorists say one variety of wormhole wraps back onto itself, so that it leads not to another universe, but back to its own entrance.
- blackmonsters.blogspot.com

So I went to some sites and it turns out what this guy proposes is not just a possibility but is on the table of scientific thought as being plausible.
Double triple quadruple eff N cool!

PS This blogger is both a PHD in Physics major, and a culinary art student. Physics and food, in another time he’d be called a sorcerer.

I totally dig the fact that these extremely powerful cosmic rays (waves of light) start their journey as ferocious quicker than spit projectiles. But once they enter our atmosphere, they break up and scatter across the earth as tiny representatives of their former size and speed. despite the fact their strength is diminished, upon entry they become immeasurable in number, enter and pass through every single thing they come into contact with. Its as a precise image of the micro and the macro as the Apple

I’ve been chipping away at the theory that the same life-giving / death-dealing processes we observe between the super structures of the cosmos (ie formation and dissolution of stars, planets black holes etc) are mirrored within the natural mechanisms of our planet, our bodies and even our own psyches.

And this brings me to the second stream: Kali.

I was inspired to dive deeper into Kali imagery and history after recognizing that just as Venusian energy had made such a distinct appearance in my life, Kali has also been making her presence known to me through dreams, synchronistic turns of events, and symbolism.

killa-kali-thumb.jpg

Desire, by Nina Paley NOT a depiction of Kali Ma - Just a Look Alike

I came fully to this recognition thanks to Hearts Post: Women’s Country and realized Kali’s been haunting the back rooms of my mind for some time, in the guise of Lillith, in the guise of Crone (Hecate) in the guise of Spider Woman, even in the guise of Venus, In her bright aspect, Venus prompts humankind forward through our desires. Desires for flight, for refrigerated goods, for sumptuous music: this age is definitely marked by the projected desires of human nations. In her dark aspect, she is straightforward, her desires have nothing to do with building commerce or families or civilization, her lust is for her own individual satisfaction. Her energy is strongly felt in the numerous wars spreading across the planet.

Both sides of Venus are integrated within Kali Ma.

With the above mentioned Black Hole notes I’ve chosen, consider these descriptions of Kali Ma.

Talk about cool…

http://thesoulsjourney.com/kali.html
Poets and mystics advise us that in order to know Her we must plunge into Her luscious, radiant, blackness, dive through our fear of the unknown, into Her overwhelming mystery and allow ourselves to dissolve in Her velvety midnight embrace.

http://www.exoticindiaart.com/kali.htm
Kali’s dwelling place, the cremation ground denotes a place where the five elements (Sanskrit: pancha mahabhuta) are dissolved. Kali dwells where dissolution takes place.

kalimother.jpg

Many stories describe Kali’s dance with Shiva as one that “threatens to destroy the world” by its savage power. Art historian Stella Kramrisch has noted that the image of kali dancing with Shiva follows closely the myth of the demon Daruka. When Shiva asks his wife Parvati to destroy this demon, she enters Shiva’s body and transforms herself from the poison that is stored in his throat. She emerges from Shiva as Kali, ferocious in appearance, and with the help of her flesh eating retinue attacks and defeats the demon.

http://www.goddess.ws/mother_kalis_picture.html

Name: Kali is so called because She devours Kala (time) and then resumes Her own dark formlessness. She is the embodiment of three gunas (qualities of nature): She creates with Her sattva guna (quality of goodness and purity), preserves with rajas (passion and activity), and destroys with tamas (ignorance and inertia).

Complexion: Her complexion is deep blue, like the sky. As the sky is limitless, so is She. From a distance one sees the ocean water as blue, but it is colorless and transparent when examined closely.

Smiling face: She is ever-blissful.

Tongue: Kali’s white teeth symbolize sattva or serenity; Her red tongue, rajas, or activity; and Her drunkenness: tamas or inertia. The meaning: tamas can be conquered by rajas, and rajas by sattva.

Full breast: She is the nourisher of all beings.

Terrible form: She is the mother of the universe as well as the destroyer.

Necklace: It consist of fifty skulls that represent the fifty letters of the Sanskrit alphabet, the origin of sound. She is Shabda Brahman (Sound-Brahman), or Logos-the source of creation.

Naked form: She is called digambari, “clad in space.” She is infinite, so no finite dress can cover Her.

http://hinduism.about.com/library/weekly/aa051202a.htm

Her black complexion symbolizes her all-embracing and transcendental nature. Says the Mahanirvana Tantra: “Just as all colors disappear in black, so all names and forms disappear in her”. Her nudity is primeval, fundamental, and transparent like Nature — the earth, sea, and sky. Kali is free from the illusory covering, for she is beyond the all maya or “false consciousness.”

So there you have it, emerging science reflected in a luminous pool of mythic wisdom handed down through the ages by mystics and such.

In my artistic opinion, Kali Ma is the archtypical emanation of the starving naked monster at our galactic center.

This concludes my first Kali Ma Post. I hope y’all enjoyed it.

Next the Galactic Cauldron. (still in progress)

Next in the Kali Ma series: MA(crocosm) Kali’s Macrocosmic nature

80 Responses leave one →
  1. 2007 November 22

    I did indeed. A very cosmic post.

  2. 2007 November 29

    Dear Hazel,

    I very much appreciated this post. I myself identify with the Goddess Venus, and too, I follow the philosophy of Paul Hartal, the founder of the Centre for Art, Science and Technology. One of the many subjects he has painted, written and lectured on is the cosmos.

    Here is the abstract from an article he wrote, entitled:
    Homage to a Blue Planet: Aeronautical and Astronomical Artworks
    Paul Hartal
    Leonardo, Vol. 25, No. 2 (1992), pp. 211-215
    doi:10.2307/1575714

    “The author views space exploration as a human activity that transcends science and technology. He suggests that the ecological objective to save the earth is a beautiful and moral mission in which the arts should play a central role. Thus, aeronautics includes planetary consciousness; ethics is aesthetics. The author discusses space art, star sailing and his cosmological paintings.”

    His weblink can be found on my brand new blog:
    http://theartistinyoumuseletter.blogspot.com/

    THANK YOU FOR THIS POST!
    MUAH!
    xoxox

  3. 2007 December 3

    Hi Shoshana, I googled Paul Hartel, very impressive I’m looking forward to learning more about his manifesto and Lyrical
    Conceptualism. Very exciting, thanks for the tip :)
    Nice blog btw, I really loved the post “Passion Pep Talk”
    Fabulous!

  4. 2008 July 4

    http://hazel8500.wordpress.com/2008/07/02/brooding-kali/

    http://hazel8500.wordpress.com/2008/07/02/mothers-multiplicity/

  5. 2008 August 10

    What a wonderful post!

    I really felt chills reading it and it has inspired me to delve deeper into the concept of Kali. I recently took part in a ritual where Kali was represented by a friend who had tied her long red hair up in two pig tails and painted her face and arms, along with the fluid movements and poking her tongue out really was incredible – I felt the destructive power and sheer hopelessness of dispair before her. Thankyou for putting this together, I will certainluy be watching this space.
    regards
    David

  6. 2008 August 10

    Oh David, you’ve made my day. Thank you so much for sharing feelings and experiences here.

    I have tons more to add to the subject so I’ll be sure to think of you during my next post.

    Cheers!

  7. 2008 August 11
    Hoshi permalink

    I truly believe that the goddess Kali Ma is by far the most amazing of almost all of the Avatars, excluding Krishna and Vishnu (if its to be said that they arent the same). I was extremely impressed with your knowledge of Kali Ma, most websites i see only depict her as a blood thirsty Goddess, but in reality upon her throne she actually was said to be the Goddess who remembered the dead when no one else is alive to remember them, along with Shiva. She is truly the most inspirational to me at least. I wish to learn about her Human Avatars as well.

    Thank you,
    Hoshi

  8. 2008 August 21

    Hoshi! Blowing you kisses, thank you for your kind words. Human avatars? I’ll have to look into that too.
    Peace to ya!
    Hazel.

  9. 2008 August 29
    Hoshi permalink

    Hazel, Thanks for the kisses. haha. yeah but i havent been able to pull up much on her human avatars, lest she be less popular than Vishnu and Hari Krishna, let me know what you find :)

    Greatest wishes,
    Hoshi

  10. 2008 August 30

    Hi Hoshi,
    Nice to see you.

    I did find some information. I began writing you a response and it became pretty huge. Too big to post here so if you like you can read Avatars and Kali Ma here:
    http://hazel8500.wordpress.com/2008/08/30/avatars-and-kali-ma/

    I found four candidates for you to read up on. Links included.

    Hope you find it helpful.
    Hazel.

  11. 2008 September 28

    Hi Conman, I suspect you’re talking about the cartoon depiction? I have several images of Her fierceness in this blog. The artist who created this image did not intend it to be a depiction of Kali, it’s Desire. I’m the one who thought it looked like Kali. So if you have a problem with the image being here, close the page – or threaten me. Leave the artist out of it.

    Personally I don’t see any thing dirty about the depiction, no dirtier or more shocking than any other depiction of Kali, all naked, free breasted and ferocious like.

    But I’ll keep your note here, along with your IP and email address just in case you try to make good on your threat.

  12. 2008 October 12
    unoanimo permalink

    Beautiful picture of Kali!!!

  13. 2008 October 13

    I really like them too. You can google Durga (another incarnation of Kali) and find all sorts of fabulous images of her.

  14. 2008 November 9
    Eyewitness permalink

    “In my artistic opinion, Kali Ma is the archtypical emanation of the starving naked monster at our galactic center.”

    I could never imagine that you God-forsaken Christians could fall so low as to shamelessly and deliberately depict one of the most respected goddesses of the Hindu fold as a “starving naked monster” to glorify your own religion.

    I wish someday I too could violate Jesus in the same way. That is the only way one can deal with puritanical and hypocritical Christians like you, who believe that the world is filled demons and monsters and witches et.al..

    Even African witch doctors are more civilized than you subhumans.

  15. 2008 November 10

    I just spit hot cocoa out over reading this comment.

    You’ve got to be kidding? First of all I’m not a Christian nor am I god forsaken, nor do I write for anyone’s perspective but “my OWN artistic opinion’. So if you have a problem with what I write direct it to me and not to ‘you god forsaken Christians. ‘

    As for the starving naked monster quote? That is a description of the NAKED singularity at the center of our galaxy that happens to be STARVING at the moment. Our very own local super massive black hole, which by any ones standards is indeed a galactic monster. Did you understand half of what you read here before you began to shit all over it? Doubtful.

    Here let me h e l p you out;

    This beloved Hindu goddess is older than Hinduism itself and is not a goddess per say but an emanation of a feminine power. The Hindu’s call this mother power Shakti, she’s also known as Kundalini, and as the Greek Zoe, and even as Eve. This power has been described by Hindu’s and Christians and every other belief system in between. She is known as the creator; as the mother of the gods, and as the destroyer: of time.

    Well what the buck to you think a black hole does? yeah right it destroys, or rather devours time space light everything. in its destroyer capacity.

    In its creator capacity? It shoots out something called cosmic rays. Do you know what cosmic rays do? They write DNA. So yeah, asshole my description of Kali Ma as the Super Massive Black Hole situated in Sagittarius is apt, and respectful.

    Eyewitness, you wrote: “I wish someday I too could violate Jesus in the same way”

    Well good for you. You gotta dream a little dream…

    You continue to amuse me with “That is the only way one can deal with puritanical and hypocritical Christians like you,”

    Really?
    “who believe that the world is filled demons and monsters and witches et.al..”

    Is that what I believe?

    huh, did not know that. Thanks for the edumacation, chump.

  16. 2009 January 8
    Carol permalink

    Oh, I’m so relieved to see you replied that absurd comment properly. It was ridiculously nonsense.
    I love your vision by the way.

  17. 2009 January 10

    Oh Carol, Thank You!

  18. 2009 February 1
    martin permalink

    To Hazel
    ALL YOU HAVE WRITTEN :making a relation between kali ma and black hole at galactic centre of this universe is good but ur last lines in ur explanation r showing thtit is an insult to super power of this universe,one more thing is tht the above cartoon should be taken out frm this website with immediate effect ,u should know tht whatever may be the religion no one is having the right to play the sentiments of people by showing cartoonic pictures of god and goddess .Without any argument i challenge u to show the picture od prophet mohmmad on the same page ,U know very well tht entire molem world will search u to eliminate u out of this earth crust.Also u don`t know the exact history of kali ma as u know zero about sanskrit which is the only source to know the hindu vedas. And don`t think tht u are over intelligent in the knowledgeof this topicit seems tht this the above information is written by a hypocritic personwho is trying to show his extreme knowledge . If u really r thn tell me bout those particles which only a few black holes release.GO AND SEARCH ON THIS INTERNET WITH A HOPE OF FAILED ATTEMPT. I KNOW THT U DON`T HAVE THE ANSWER FOT ALL WRITTEN BY ME N STILL WILL TRY TO BOAST UR INTELLIGENCE N CROOKEDNESS BY WRITING SOME ILLOGICAL THINGS.I cannot believe tht such an educated person like u has responced by abusing to the man who was trying to defend his religious sentiments.

  19. 2009 February 1
    MARTIN permalink

    TO CAROL
    It seems tht u don`t have ur own mind to apply n is here only to support ppl whose enjoy abusing others and u know very well tht such type of ppl r classified as 4th class ppl(ask ur dad bout dis).Good luck to carry on for same backgroung.

  20. 2009 February 1

    Martin, you wrote:

    I cannot believe tht such an educated person like u has responced by abusing to the man who was trying to defend his religious sentiments.

    First, I’m not an educated person. Second this man was dissing MY religious and spiritual sentiments. Whats more he did so in MY electric sacred space.

    Second: you wrote:
    And don`t think tht u are over intelligent in the knowledgeof this topicit seems tht this the above information is written by a hypocritic personwho is trying to show his extreme knowledge .

    Your typos, spelling errors and assumptions that I am a man, are about as accurate as everything else you’ve written here.

    Third: what you wrote to Carol exposes you for what you are, you are the one who is only here to support “ppl whose enjoy abusing others.”

    Chump.

  21. 2009 February 4
    rahul natthani permalink

    an excellant combination of maa kali and the science.
    excellant….

  22. 2009 February 4

    Thank you Rahul!
    xo

  23. 2009 March 16
    vishwa permalink

    i dont get it with the godess holding such obscene stuff and her being naked.

    if its to show hatred than FUCK YOU if not than sry.

  24. 2009 March 16
    vishwa permalink

    whatever u r trying to say in this post here is fine but REMOVE THE PICTURE OF MOTHER KALI IN CARTOON FORM.

  25. 2009 March 16

    Vishwa, the depiction of Kali holding the severed head and other ‘obscene’ stuff is an ancient prehistoric depiction of the goddess. It does not represent hate, it represents liberation from the Ego – the ultimate gift Kali can bestow on her children. This liberation is called moksha. Her nakedness represents the fact She is above illusion – nothing can cover Her as she covers All. The dark goddess is blue black, like the ocean. She’s naked, clad only in space. She’s full breasted as the nourisher of all life. For an indepth history of what Kali’s iconography (story in pictures) read this post… http://hazel8500.wordpress.com/2008/04/20/macrocosm/ or use google.

    regarding your last comment where you wrote:
    whatever u r trying to say in this post here is fine but REMOVE THE PICTURE OF MOTHER KALI IN CARTOON FORM.

    I have to ask, if you consider Kali as a Mother then why do you know so little about her? Why are you so offended by her imagery? Why such a prude?
    Secondly, as I’ve tried to explain to numerous complainers such as yourself – the cartoon depiction seen in this post is NOT Kali herself, but rather the extraordinary cartoonist Nina Paley’s depiction of her own ID. Which in my view is pretty spectacular and resembles Kali Ma to a T. Ver Batim from MA(CROCOSM): The depiction of Desire by Ms. Paley is cartoonish but true to the ancient depictions of the Dark Goddess Kali which as I’ll demonstrate incorporates the Microcosmic view of the universe.

    In fact Ms. Paley contacted me (I know, how exciting!) to let me know that this image is not Kali per se, but her own Id, who just happens to look like Kali’s twin sister.

    Lastly Vishwa I accept your apology.

  26. 2009 March 17
    engree permalink

    i am very much agree with marteen. more over i suggest you to put your mother’s, your sister’s and your wife’s nude photos on the site as well as maohmad and mother marry.
    you have not accepted the chalange it shows that you are cowerd, EUNUCH
    IMPOTENT,NEUTER

  27. 2009 March 19

    For Engre

    1.) Mother Mary and Vagina of Guadalupe Candles http://hazel8500.wordpress.com/2007/06/05/tags/

    2.) Sacred Heart, Venus and Women
    http://hazel8500.wordpress.com/2007/03/27/how-the-fate-of-venus-and-women-are-entwined/

    For everyone else sqwaking about Kali’s nakedness. She is meant to be naked , it is HER image, she’s been black and naked and ferocious for thousands of years before I popped out of her black hole. Her naked gruesome imagery was not dreamed up by me, though I love it… I didn’t create it.

    Those of you claiming she is sacred and its wrong to picture her naked… You are fools, liars and hypocrytes. If you loved Kali, you’d get her nakedness, you’d respect and honor her naked power instead of trying to cover Her up.

    Go do some research into the Dark Mother before you start lipping off about it to me — or expect to get bitch slapped, hard.

  28. 2009 March 19

    Hazel,I saw the above pic of goddess Kali,its very sad that this kind of pic is posted on the site..plez remove it its very hurting…for the people who worship her…u would never know the meaning of kali maa
    word “maa” means mother to us,i dnt think u will do some thing like this to ur mother….will u?…

  29. 2009 March 19

    Kali Ma is my mother too. Her ancient iconagraphy is as sacred to me as is Her name and purpose. To ask me to remove her imagery is asking me to be ashamed of My Mother. That’s just plain rude. All this hurt and controversy over Kali’s appearance is inane. This is how She has been depicted since before written language was even invented. I say, get over yourselves and leave me to honor Her as She has seen fit to have me honor Her. Thank you.

  30. 2009 March 19
    Girish permalink

    Hazel do u really think the “obscene” thing in her hand is Moksha.
    Sorry but u r wrong….if u really love her as a mother u wont do this.

  31. 2009 March 20

    Girish, firstly thank you for being so civil in this matter. Secondly I don’t think there is anything obscene about this image. The Lingam, Moksha, Yoni, they are all representative of beautiful things, gifts of creation, compassion and life. How can I see those things as obscene?

    You tell me I can’t love Kali like a mother otherwise I would act differently towards Her. Really? Are you psychic? Do you know what’s in my heart? Do you also expect your siblings to feel think talk to your mother in the exact same way you do? In my view that is unreasonable. As unreasonable as anyone telling me how I should love and honor those I love and honor.

    This is my personal blog and not up for your review or approval. If you don’t approve, don’t come around.

  32. 2009 March 25
    rahul permalink

    Hey, everybody is just trying to tell you to respect the religious sentiments.
    People were just responding to you by only saw the ‘kali maa’ picture which won’t be accepted by Hindus. The offended part of the picture is what you show in her right hand.
    I read the information you given in blog, which is very right and true.

    I would suggest you to create something in realistic form because at first glance it seems that you making fun or abusing the goddess.

    Keep up the good work.
    I am glad that you have interest in Indian culture. You will get the opportunity to learn more nice stuffs.

    Maa Kalli bless you!

  33. 2009 March 26

    Thank you Rahul for for giving me some insight into the ire being directed at me. I will think about your advice and see what I can do. Thank for your wisdom and you kindness.
    Much appreciated.

  34. 2009 March 27
    raaka permalink

    the cartoon kali is sick.

  35. 2009 March 28

    Once again… For the sake of clarity, this cartoon picture is NOT Kali Ma, as I’ve tried to explain numerous times before in this post and others around here. This cartoon is a depiction of the artists ID, which happens to look a heck of a lot like our Dark Mother. As far as I’m concerned its an apt depiction of how She resides at the centre of all of us.

    Sometimes its worth doing a little research before criticizing a stranger.

  36. 2009 March 28
    raaka permalink

    Peace

    this is outrage of average Hindu.i found this pic in google images.
    i dint read anything or dared to read

  37. 2009 March 30

    Hazel,

    People read and see what they want to believe for good or ill. This thread will continue until you decide to pull the plug… or not, knowing how stubborn you are. :)

  38. 2009 March 30

    Hi Brian, I do believe you are right. At the moment I am more stubborn than I am interested in censorship. So up it stays.
    xo

  39. 2009 April 5

    Hazel ………i was searching through the web for ma kali’s images since i wanted a print out for a poster to be placed in our temple during the ongoing Ma kali utsav.I want to tell u i was shocked and hurted by the image of Ma Kali in ur blog.You are right Ma is naked and she destroys,and i’ve seen her naked form a trillion times and the emotion i feel is pure reverence…but unfortunately ur image really brought tears of pain into my eyes.She is not my Ma Kali…
    I can only request you,even beg you…cuz i am no crazy religious fanatic,but a true follower of my religion which talks of ahimsa and only later of destruction of the demons………….

    PLEASE PLEASE REMOVE THE PIC….it’s not Ma Kali….please.

  40. 2009 April 6

    PJ, you are so observant and I’m so pleased that you realize this cartoon pic is NOT Kali Ma. Please read through the post and comments to find out who she is and what she’s doing here. *(hint click on the offensive picture) If you still don’t figure it out after reading… write back and I’ll let you in on who she is.
    Sorry for your tears of sadness and pain. They are shed in error. best wishes, hazel.

  41. 2009 April 12

    Beautiful. I came here following the cartoon image of Kali because of a mission I was given on the Joy Rebel blog to come up with my own superhero figure. I love both the images you have here on your site and appreciate the essay on parallels between Black Holes and Kali Ma.

    To those who beg you to remove the cartoon image, I would say: Don’t worry about Kali Ma; she can take it! Is the universe insulted by the yin-yang symbol? No symbol is ever truly representative. They are all just human artistic expression of something of which we can only glimpse a corner. Our iconography neither weakens nor strengthens their reality, their absolute power.

  42. 2009 April 13

    “Is the universe insulted by the yin-yang symbol? ”

    That absolutely delighted me! Kiki, perfectly said and thank you.

    I was telling someone just yesterday how ironic this whole debate is, Kali embraces all sides, and non-sides. How could She possibly be offended by my attentions? She is like oxygen, it doesn’t matter who breathes in, innocent babies, frustrated bankers, lovers, enemies, men and women on death row… She sustains all, without prejudice. Its that last part the ‘without prejudice’ that causes me to feel so much affection for Her.

    Mother Kali loves us warts and all. How can anyone not adore that? And who are we to judge each other’s personal relationship to Her?

    Thank-you Kikipotamus for brightening my morning!
    Hazel.

  43. 2009 May 17

    I haven’t even gotten through the entire post -not to mention those incredible comments- but i just had to drop a comment. I know this is an old post, but I just happened to be working on a line of synchronistic research that has also led me to Kali (by way of Astarte and Madonna); really wonderful stuff.

    I’ll have a new post mentioning Kali and some of her cosmic contemporaries in an upcoming post at The Patternist and I’d love to here your thoughts.

  44. 2009 May 23

    Dearest Toure, OMGoddess OMGoddess OMGoddess I am completely entranced by your blog. I fully relate to the title of your blog, the Patternist. I just read through http://thepatternist.blogspot.com/2009/05/sacred-sex-popped-stars-and-holy-babble.html and got goosebumps. I got it. You`ve got it! Its close to 3 am and I gotta go to bed, I`ll be back later when I can. I`m away from home and am stealing moments from other people`s computers. I have so much more I`d like to say to you, but I just can`t keep my eyes open. I will be back.

    with genuine glee…
    Hazel.

  45. 2009 May 31
    sunny permalink

    i believe in god n ma kali.i my self i very much appreciated this post

  46. 2009 June 1

    Dear Sunny, I am so happy you enjoyed this post! I love god and ma kali, and I so enjoy conversing with other people who do too.

    Many blessings to you dear.

  47. 2009 June 5
    bambam lolo permalink

    u fuckin idiots thats really imature how dare u put a picture up like that of kali ma and disrespect a religion in wich she is worshiped how u like if sum1 put a pic of jesus holding a dick and has a black hole …….u wouldint right so u should take that pic off b4 i post a gay pic of jesus on my web page

  48. 2009 June 5

    You’re right Bambam I wouldn’t mind if someone posted a pic of Jesus holding his dick.

    Couldn’t find that image but did find this excellent one of Gay Jesus getting a kiss. Enjoy!
    http://kspark.kaist.ac.kr/Jesus/Gay%20Jesus_files/jesus%20kiss.jpg
    artwork by Becki Jane Harrelson

  49. 2009 June 10
    TOLI permalink

    IM A LAYMAN IN THESE MATTERS, BUT THE PORTIONS UNDERSTOOD HAVE HELPED ME ON MY QUEST FOR ANSWERS RE: WHY, WHEN, ECT OF THE COSMOS

  50. 2009 June 11

    Hi Toli, I’m a layman too :) I’m so glad my article helped in any small way with your quest for answers. I hope you maintain your thirst for cosmic knowledge, because as they say seek and ye shall find.
    I’m very happy to have received your comment,
    Hazel.

  51. 2009 June 11
    chandni sunny permalink

    chandni pa traka twa ma kali la pou nous li nous pou re vine ene sel nou i love you boucou ta plz plz plz re vine dans mo la ta plz plz

  52. 2009 June 12
    sunny permalink

    i love chandni and she love me too. but now she love someone.i don’t did wrong with her.maa kali she will come to me i love her too much she is my life

  53. 2009 June 13

    Dear Chandni, I thank you for visiting this website and leaving your comments. My Creole is rusty, however I can read enough to be touched by your message.

  54. 2009 July 18
    Siddharth permalink

    just came across these comments,was really pleased to see what you think abut kali,just because of all the info in this blog i am a fan of kali maa hazel appreciate your work keep writing so that we can know more about mahavidya kali & the black hole…..thanks..

  55. 2009 July 24
    Amit permalink

    Dear Hazel
    Its nice of you to discover the similarity between Black hole and Maa kali. I read all the posts made by the above readers, and viewed both sides of the coin. You are right when you say that its not Maa Kali and its your prerogative to delete or not delete this image. But my friend when u show a man in a beer bar even if he is having orange juice, people will take him for a drinker. Morover google has already associated the image with ma kali. I understand that its ur personal blog, and u dont feel like changing it or may be – Its that u like the no. of hits/clicks it gets per day. But then do you think that by hurting someone unintentionally or intentionally(as in this case it has turned out)will you get something out of it. You may outshine the smartest guy or girl on this planet but is it the only thing that concerns you. We as individual human beings may not responsible for actions that govern the world but then we affect others lives daily in our course of action. You cannot imagine how many people would have been affected by this pic, as in india millions of people worship her in body clad by hands and heads. Hindus are not that liberal to have their gods mocked at, even i as an atheist a non-believer would not like to pose them, or depict them in this manner. In the end its ur decision i just tried to put my point forward although it doesnt concern an individual like me who is an atheist but then even if we know that we are not doing wrong, we should take back our actions if others and especially many of them (not some) consider it wrong.

    I am by my own, no god no luck just me – Amit

    Hello Amit. Thank you for your sincere and diplomatic comments.
    You suggest that even if I believe I am doing no wrong, I should cease my actions AND take back what I’ve done or in this case wrote IF the majority rules in my disfavor. WTF? Pardon my acronym but really consider what you are saying. You are advocating for one to bend to peer pressure. You might as well tell me to go jump off a bridge cuz every one else is doing it. As an athiest what are you doing inserting yourself into this discussion between a blogger and fanatics intent on pushing their views and threats btw, down her throat?

    Really what’s your motivation for sermonizing me? I bet it’s a girl right? You’re trying to impress a girl! Oh that’s adorable.

    Amit, you’re good people. Just one piece of advise … Be yourself, think for yourself. You’ve got the brains to go far in life. Use them.

    Sincerely,
    Hazel.

    It occurred to me the following quote is curiously perfect for the discussion on this thread. Enjoy.

    Most truths are so naked that people feel sorry for them and cover them up, at least a little bit. – Edward Morrow.

  56. 2009 September 14
    sri permalink

    hi hazel ,
    it is evident from the comments posted above and ur answers to them that ur quite indifferent to the sentiments of people…its ok most assholes are…now the point is ur research is also flawed and myopic.Kali is the goddess of destruction and what follows her ravages is catharsis and bliss which restore the world.In ur language that perhaps is called doomsday or the end of the world and like wise there comes a stage in the history of mankind when destruction is compulsive for peace and prosperity to follow- kali is that force which brings about the transition and regeneration.

    ok so that was knowledge enough to address ur ignorance(illiteracy)….the bottomline is we call her mother goddes and just to give a feel of how we felt about the post i would ask u to visualise the same pic with a tiny change -imagine ur mother in place of goddess kali…i give u two options she can be imagined holding ur father’s reproductive asset or her illicit customers’-..but given the bastard that u are i do not think the choice of dicks would matter that much..so u may as well volunteer ur impotent organ for the same…..

    felt bad…..exactly..that’s how we feel too..
    felt indifferent……get a dick transplant..i am sure u lack one…

  57. 2009 September 14

    Dear goofball,
    Kali is sooo much more than the goddess of destruction. But you should already know that, right? Since you’ve claimed you’ve read all my writings on this subject, I won’t bother debating the finer details of Her Ferociousness with you.

    I will address this however;

    ok so that was knowledge enough to address ur ignorance(illiteracy)….the bottomline is we call her mother goddes and just to give a feel of how we felt about the post i would ask u to visualise the same pic with a tiny change -imagine ur mother in place of goddess kali…i give u two options she can be imagined holding ur father’s reproductive asset or her illicit customers’

    Do you know how many of your like minded fiends have come here and suggested exactly that? Complete with misspelled insults to my literacy, too funny!

    The imagery you propose doesn’t bother me one iota.

    Nakedness is Kali’s only garment. Sexuality is the gift that brings forth life and light, I feel no shame in my mothers nakedness nor do I feel shame about my own.

    I LOVE Kali, as a mother, as a goddess, as my creator, sustainer and liberator.

    Kali loves us all, the good the bad the ugly, the insignificant. Kali is the mother of untouchables, the misfits, the goofs, assholes and bastards as much as she is the mother of saintly little you. And she loves us ALL. Including wait for it, wait for it… ME.

    You may have been born into a caste system that worships Kali, good for you you are blessed. I was CALLED by Kali, I am blessed.

    RE this piece of delicious foolishness you wrote about my mother :

    i give u two options she can be imagined holding ur father’s reproductive asset or her illicit customers’-..

    but given the bastard that u are i do not think the choice of dicks would matter that much..so u may as well volunteer ur impotent organ for the same…..

    Gah what is with you people that keep insulting my manhood? You think only a MAN would venture to talk about Kali the way I do?

    As for my impotent organ… I don’t have a dick, you know why? I am a WOMAN and as a woman I’m not only a daughter of Kali, I am a representative of Her power here on Earth as ALL women are.

    I think you and your ‘kind’ who are so fixated on my ‘dick’ and my mama are total repressed lunatics.
    You purposefully ignore Kali’s sexuality and persecute anyone who might adore her in a fashion that makes you folks uncomfortable.

    Access to heaven, nirvana, bliss whatever you want to call it is located squarely between the legs of women, all women including THIS woman. Who taught us that? OUR mother, Kali. OUR mother Inanna, OUR mother Isis, Our Mother Venus, Our Mother Erzulie, Our Mother Mary. In every time, in every corner, in every nation, one of Her avatars has made sure women maintained their power even if it meant hoarding it in secrecy.

    Shame on You for continuing to wrestle control from HER by admonishing people how they can or cannot adore her! How dare YOU even try to come between a devotee and her Goddess? May Kali slake Her rage with your ignorance, may she bless you with Moksha once the deed is done.

  58. 2009 September 15
    Jaijeet permalink

    Hazel you are such a pest! u dupe idiot bad ass women u must have craved throughout ur life for dicks thats why you like them so much or you are a prostitute of some kind that you derive pleasure from obscenity

    Put ur picture or your mother’s This will drastically increase the number of clicks to your website which you really want.

    Seems like you are a nymphomaniac that no man ever dared to fuck ur stinking ass and thought it below his dignity to get a blowjob from you……

  59. 2009 September 16

    LOL that’s not what you said last night!

  60. 2009 September 16
    jaijeet permalink

    sorry granny are u mistaking me with the gigolo u were fucking last night????

    - Yeah Yo Mama

  61. 2009 September 16
    Amit permalink

    o hazel

    Its such a pitty that you are comparing my interest in your blog to cheap “impress” tactics. I think while writing last time I did it in a paragraph. I think I should have put it in bullet points which I am going to do now:

    1. I told you to take back your actions not because majority rules in your disfavor but because majority is hurt by your deeds. Would you continue doing something that is righteous however harms your family or your peers. And what can you get ! by ignoring this. Well an endless battle of words between Fanatic blogger & Devotees of goddess. And Old lady nobody is telling you to jump off the bridge; what an unusual comparison btw. Dont worry about the unparliamentary language i.e. WTF , because i have not lost my literary sense, you might have.

    2. What am i doing here: Though the fact remains the same that I am an atheist but tell me one thing that being an atheist is a personal choice; as an atheist should I take on a mission of arguing with people about the existence of god. I am here because the portrayal of women that is dear to my people yes my people is not right. Yes I can visit a church also if someone tells me to because that doesnt change my belief. However it will bring smiles to some. Thing to be discussed here is not your belief or your thesis; its just a picture.

    3. Dear madam, i am not sermonizing you first of all. And may be its a trend at your place: that putting up comments and rather intelligent comments get you girls or may be thats how you might have been impressed as well. Men write romantic poetry to lure girls (although I am good at that also) and not their views. I just wrote because i thought between this clutter of abuses, you might have missed the intentions of people. Its quite normal for people to get angry and understand nothing in mid of name calling. And since it affects my people, i am bound to reply.

    4. I know i have got talent. Thank you for your appreciation madam. I am using them trying to tell you that good can be done. So i am right if i am putting myself in this. Tell me what better can be done than trying to achieve “Greatest good of the greatest numbers” Thats me &
    Thats the difference !

    I like debating with people, your whole theory is interesting except for that stigma !

    And answer (self written) to your quote :

    Thomas Elva Edison invented bulb and brought light to world; and Dan Brown came up with declassifying (quite convincing) novel named: Da-Vinci Code which did upset people all over the world. Which truth you want to uncover that light can be generated or Jesus had an affair with Mary Magdalene. Where do you want to see yourself???

    With due regards:

    I am by my own, no god no luck just me!!!

    Amit

  62. 2009 September 16

    O Amit, You’re a dear.
    But I don’t need you to explain to me what these people are angry about. I know it’s the one image that causes some people discomfort. With regards to your sleezy innuendo’s yes I am a woman, no I am not old, no I am not a lesbian, and yes I am married.

    Despite your earlier implication I wrote about Kali simply because I’m a Hit whore, garnering hits was not my reason for writing it, my passion was. Which incidentally is also the guna or special quality equated with Kali Ma

    However, my naive enthusiasm has caused quite a stir it seems. This post has gotten over 26,000 hits, 62 comments, 17 of which are complaints written by 11 different people. Of which a handful are abusive and one, (no longer posted) was a death threat.

    Which sort of proves the first point on your bullet list

    1) I told you to take back your actions not because majority rules in your disfavor but because majority is hurt by your deeds.

    is completely wrong. and here’s why out of 26,000 hits and 62 comments only 11 are opposed to this post.

    But back to the offensive and hurtful image that you and these 11 others are so hot and bothered by.

    As an atheist perhaps you are not familiar with what Kali Ma is supposed to look like?

    She’s Blue Black, Naked except for a girdle of severed arms and a skull bone necklace. She has red eyes, disheveled black hair, a protruding tongue and sharp fangs, she is covered in blood, carries a severed head in one hand, a sword in another, a bowl in a third and a blessing in the fourth while she dances in ecstasy.

    Really now, isn’t that exactly what the image that is causing some people so much offense looks like? What’s the problem with this one particular image? Of the thousands of images available, this one is not much different than the others?

    If it’s the medium, a cartoon that is so offensive, I would remind readers that the most popular Hindu religious books are in cartoon form. don’t believe me? Google the terms Amar Chitra Katha comic books.

    As an athiest you also may not know that one of the most important tenets of Kali worship is that nothing in this world is profane, because all comes from Her. All aspects of creation contain Her immaculate essence. To despise that which disgusts us, is exactly what Kali worship advises us NOT to do. Because in so despising we are despising Her our Mother, and really how rude and hurtful is that?

    Earlier you wrote to me, You cannot imagine how many people would have been affected by this pic, as in india millions of people worship her in body clad by hands and heads.

    Now that is interesting.

    Because what is surely evolving out of this discussion is a picture of a small percentage of folks who claim to love Kali while attacking what they fear or hate. Who claim to honor Her as a Mother, but are ashamed of her imagery. Who feel its honorable to honor Her honor by attacking the sexuality, morality, and motivations (and mother’s) of anyone who does not honor Her as ‘They’ see fit. What an insult to Kali! That she needs to be sanitized or defended. She’s the demon slayer!

    You know what this reminds me of? The religious schism between the Fundamentalists and every one else.
    I really can’t believe you’re an atheist defending these kooks. It’s absurd.
    But, I’ll continue to humor your charade a little longer.

    You also asked , “Would you continue doing something that is righteous however harms your family or your peers.”

    I do it all the time. I don’t have the time or desire to explain to you the genesis or the scope of this blog or my reasons for blogging. In short yes, its ‘righteous”, and yes it does hurt people who are related to me.

    Now onto your next gem.

    I am here because the portrayal of women that is dear to my people yes my people is not right…

    The depiction of Women? This image is not a depiction of a woman or of women, it’s a depiction of a Goddess. A warrior Goddess, a naked, ferocious demon slaying, blood slurping, blue-black, four armed Goddess.

    (The) “Thing to be discussed here is not your belief or your thesis; its just a picture. “

    If you truly believe that, then why have you spent so many fine words coming to the defense of the side that wants it taken down? If you honestly think it’s just a picture, what’s the big deal?

    Also, It IS my belief and my essay and my choice of visual aides that are up for discussion. My blog, My idea’s, My selection of Art, My Comment Box.

    With regards to your #3 item… Eeew yuck.
    Okay you are drunk. Right? Men write poetry to lure girls?
    Wait a second… Are you my stalker?

    Onto point #4

    blah blah blah, more insults ah Here we go ” And since it affects my people, i am bound to reply.”

    Oh I see. Your people.
    So even though you know I’m right,

    (Your words, not mine: You are right when you say that its not Maa Kali and its your prerogative to delete or not delete this image.)
    Even though you think I may outshine the smartest guy or girl on this planet, (again your words), you are going to stand firm with the misconceptions of your ‘peeps’.

    Yup, trying to impress a Desi girl for sure. You are so cute! Seriously, I mean that. A real charmer.

    You ask me, what better can be done than trying to achieve “Greatest good of the greatest numbers”

    How about Liberty for All?

    I like debating with people, your whole theory is interesting except for that stigma !

    Thank you, I like you too. Oddly enough it’s the same stigma you find offensive that I am also fighting against, in my own way.

    from wikipedia
    In sociological theory, a stigma is an attribute, behavior, or reputation which is socially discrediting in a particular way: it causes an individual to be mentally classified by others in an undesirable, rejected stereotype rather than in an accepted, normal one.

    Kali Ma’s Historic religious iconography matches the image that has caused such a ruckus on this thread. Why is there a stigma attached to Nina Paley’s image when there is no stigma attached to these ones?

    http://www.exoticindiaart.com/product/HT20/
    http://www.exoticindiaart.com/product/HC74/
    http://www.exoticindiaart.com/product/HH44/
    http://www.exoticindiaart.com/product/OR87/
    http://images.exoticindiaart.com/madhuban/the_dark_mother_goddess_kali_pj97.jpg
    http://www.greatdreams.com/kali2.jpg
    http://images.exoticindiaart.com/batik/kali_ma_bi23.jpg

    Really what’s your problem ?

  63. 2009 September 17
    Amit permalink

    Your posts emanate enough of anger, calm down lady

    Well, I feel better now that you know what these people are really talking about. You are very much concerned about your status “Women, not old, not lesbian, married” anyways thanks for the information. I dont know why but i feel the person i am addressing is either a hindu or an indian. Just an observation, might be wrong. But if its right then there is no point in debating with you. What worst can be done when people start demeaning their own religion. You asked me why I am here. I am here for my culture.

    What do you think that the people who posted comments over your site or visited your blog are the majority; majority includes those others too who surf internet for various reasons. Search for Maa kali poster and here comes a picture of some cartoon who is holding dick directed especially towards your site. Those who dont know indian culture would obviously think that this is how indian gods and goddesses must have looked like. Does your appearance matters to you anyway. What an image to portray !

    My religeous fundamentals are very strong; I am an atheist by choice not by ignorance or defiance, I know how kali is supposed to look like whose mother whose wife is she and all the other details. In all her imagery in religeous scriptures, if you have read any like karpuradi strota – she is described as naked and dishevelled hair but holding human dick not by any chance. And nobody is sanitising Kali atleast show her the way she is. ( I have, you are arguing about the use of one image out of many I have posted of Her Ferociousness.- Hazel)

    About the images that you have attached are some dirty works of typical artists who paint anything they like without having the knowledge of indian scriptures, they paint anything they wish and name it as their thought their imagination. WTF – sorry for the unparliamentary language i used.

    And i think i am putting an end to this criss cross communication because you; are so much stubborn right now that you are not going to budge. And offcourse You only told me that you can go on to the extent of harming your own people. I think no debate after this point is possible.

    Where the hell in Indian culture do you find Kali holding a torn off dick!!!!!

    Upto you!!

    By the way, I was impressed by your interest – “Are you my stalker” well might be

    Best Regards

    “I am by my own no god no luck just me”

    Amit

  64. 2009 September 17

    Amit, My Hero. You just put a sparkle in my morning! Again your assumptions are hilarious! Your argument full of holes, and all you can say to a calm reasoned well articulated response to your insults is geeze lady calm down?

    You’re a waste of time.

    But! You have helped me understand something. It’s the DICK you are opposed to. Well that’s called a Lingam, and it’s integral to the worship of Shiva, of whom Kali is His “angry” shakti.
    There are tons of representations in Indian art of the Lingam. I’m not going to waste more time by explaining to you why Kali holding a dick is appropriate, you should already know if indeed you are who you claim you are.

    I am curious though about this comment:

    What do you think that the people who posted comments over your site or visited your blog are the majority .

    What? I’m sorry but that makes no sense. Stay in school my dear. You Will go far!

    Updated to edit: What Why do you think that the people who posted comments over on your site or visited your blog(,) are the majority . (?)
    Now that I’ve fixed your grammar and punctuation, your question, that wasn’t really stated as a quaestion at all, becomes much more clear. To answer you, AGAIN here I go…

    I think the number of people who took time to post their thoughts on my post are the MINORITY. I’m no math whiz but hmmm 26,000 hits and only 66 comments? The commentators are in the minority. Of those commentators the angry, hostile and “hurt” represent a teeny tiny fraction compared to those who support the post. Which means the complainers are an itsy bitsy eenie meenie tiny majority of the total visitors of this post.

  65. 2009 September 18
    Amit permalink

    Look at the CONTEXT lady: Lingam
    or torn off dick !!!!!!!! There is a difference.
    Did it ring a bell!

    About the italicised concluding lines, that you have put in your last comment no more explanation can be given, it depends on individual’s understanding and deductive logic. Either you dont understan it or dont want to.

    Anyways thats all. Its bye bye time for your blog. You are smart, intelligent, researched and a stubborn individual. Personally I wish you best of luck for your life. And sorry for all the disturbance i created if any.

    Best Regards

    Amit

  66. 2009 September 19

    A Lingham, my dear means PENIS. A Yoni means VAGINA.

    The depiction is linguistically and pictorially accurate.

    If your only objection to this entire post is the image of the lingham then your entire opposition to this post is misinformed. Kali receives her power from Shiva. The symbol of Shiva’s power is his Lingham. That’s why the figure is waving around a dick. She’s demonstrating her twin powers, the creative and the destructive.

    Seriously Amit, I think you’re wonderful. I just wish you’d shed some of your misconceptions. I am stubborn, thank you. So are you. And personally, I admire you for your tenacity. As for disturbance? Awww forget about it.

  67. 2009 September 19
    Amit permalink

    Is it Shiv-Ling in her hand? Are you sure ?

    Because it doesnt look like?
    Shivlingham – Where ever you see, looks like black or ash smeared? Go to some temple you will find it – black or grey colored. You are just defending the picture; with your new reasoning; thats all.
    Best regards
    Amit

  68. 2009 September 20

    Oh Amit, I wish you had quit while you were a head. Now, I’m disapointed. I thought I had sent you one your merry little way to never have to fight with you again. But, here you are. Again.

    Now back to the shenanigans.

    Shivalingham? No, that’s not what I said, that’s not what I mean. Shivalingham is a sign of the god. The Lingham is whats between His legs. What I am sure of is it’s a penis in Her hand. And I am sure that the lingham is at one extreme a symbolic penis and at the other an actual penis. I am not the artist so I can’t say with certainty but I am familiar with her work and am pretty confident she was aware of this as she composed Desire.

    I’m not just defending a picture, I am defending my right to admire it, to discuss it, I am defending the right IT has to exist.

    Oh btw give Sumit (ooops or should I say jaijeet?) a big hello from the nymphomaniac pest. :) Perhaps if the two of you knew what a lingham was for… you wouldn’t still be hanging around arguing finer points of art and religion with, erm a nympho.

    Take a ‘tip’ from an old ho http://www.selfgrowth.com/articles/Beginners_Guide_to_Lingham_Massage.html and enjoy yourself Amit for pity’s sake!

    With due respect,
    Hazel.

  69. 2009 September 22
    Amit permalink

    My dear Hazel

    To tell you the truth, I am an indian, born and brought up as an indian should be. I have seen and known much more practicality about religion – its madness and its faith. So dont try to teach me what is lingham; and what it symbolizes. Perhaps you are very much struck between religion and art. Art may be a form of religious interpretation, but religion is not an interpretation of art. So dont try to convince yourself and others that the DICK in that picture is source of power or symbolic of something. Thats sheer ignorance.

    Take my word: Go visit some temples ! Read from some authentic Indian source. See the way gods are shown when they are worshipped. If you want sensual pictures then visit , khajuraho or read kamasutra, vatsyayan sutra. And whatever your friend – artists are drawing is just a loose thought with enough of skin they want to depict relating it to religion. Context makes a lot of difference sweetheart.

    Let your right to keep the image prevail.

    And by the way if you are telling me to inform jaijeet or sumit or whosover it meant; then i cannot do so. because i dont know them, I am using a public network and a public computer, so if you are trying to relate it with IP address, then you are mistaken. And by the way, i know everything about lingham, more than you know since I have one – Its functionality, usage and techniques. Perhaps that was your failed attempt to flank your false reasoning.
    Pity for you!

    Yes, I also wished that I should have left! but then thanks to your blatant choice of words which keep me coming back.

    With utmost respect to women
    Amit

  70. 2009 September 22
    Amit permalink

    Corrigendum to the above post!!

    I am an indian and brought up as an ideal hindu should be. – Refer first line. Before you derive the pleasure of fault-finding of some grammatical errors and punctuation made not by ignorance but unknowingly.

    Regards

    Amit

    Dear Amit, please explain how a real Hindu brought up to be an Ideal Hindu can call himself an Athiest without any sense of Irony?
    Please explain how an Athiest would spend countless of hours debating not the scientific merits of this post, but rather the insult he feels he and his “people” have endured due to one womans literal though artistic interpretation of a lingham? Is it as a Hindu you object to the image? As an athiest? Or as a man?

    PS. Seeing as you are multi lingual (Bravo btw!) you may have misunderstood what the word ignorance means… Unknowing! You’ve come to edumacate me on my ignorance. Turn around, my dear is fair play. (hey check out the etymology of lingual for kicks! You might learn something fabulous about Shiva and Kalis true nature!)

  71. 2009 September 23

    Amit, first let me tell you I am too tired this morning to give your latest posts the smackdown they deserve. Perhaps I’ll be back later. In the meantime you lie! I know who you are, where you are from and who Kumar is too. Your Ips were only the jumping point for my investigation into your high weirdness.

    I’m not about to disclose my particular methods too you. Sort of like throwing pearls before swine.
    The second and last thing I have to say to you is you are a hypocrite. Entertaining for sure. I’d even go so far as to say you’re adorable. Adorable but transparent. I see right through you.

  72. 2009 September 24
    Amit permalink

    O hazel

    Do you know, That I am a keen observer too. Whenever you dont have answer or explanation to defend your point of view, you come up with some sort of personal attack on me. Perhaps now you may be visiting some temple, or referring to some literature so that you can outshine me.

    And thats why, you thought of asking me, what kind of atheist I am. Since i think we share quite a good presence on your blog, I consider you telling that till 12th Standard I have been well versed in sanskrit and hindu religion. However I realized that why should i bow down in front of some one who cannot change the way life is. Since then I consider my self not dependent on God, & more independent. However i dont mock at gods. My family believes in hinduism, and even if i dont like I still visit temple. Thats all about my atheism.

    I am debating with you because as a person (indeed a man), thats not the correct way to depict her: affecting my people. Believe it or deny it her presence is a part of my culture. I know its difficult to understand but thats the way it is.

    And yes dear lady I am not a hypocrite, being atheist and raising voice for something wrong – published or shown; are 2 different aspects.

    The use of word unknowingly in my last comment meant unintentionally (Refer to Dictionary) and ignorance meant – being unaware. Unawareness depicts lack of knowledge and unintentionally means by fault or mistake. You are so good with words, your vocabulary so vivid ( Believe me I have to refer dictionary sometimes). But sadly you are bad at understanding context of words and equally at understanding humans.

    And the most hillarious part of your reply (i literally hurt myself while laughing)
    “I know who kumar is too”

    My dear Hazel, my full name is Amit Kumar ( Amit – First name; and Kumar – last name ). I am currently in mumbai, India

    “I see right through you”
    Oh i am scared. My dear friend; you should have asked me – I would have told you right there and then. I am not affraid of revealing my identity (I think you are).

    Kudos to you

    PS: I am much more adorable physically. Since you are so much technologically advanced to discover so many things about me, you must have found that too by now.

    Take care dear friend

    Amit

  73. 2009 September 24

    Amit, first I’m sure you are attractive in person.
    Young too I expect. I have no further interest arguing with you about Kail Ma. We’ve gone over the same ground repeatedly, and so far ” my dear”, I’ve yet to read anything by you that I’ve not already responded too. Also, I’m on vacation so my time to debate you is short. As for insults you as Jaijit or whatever and as Amit, have called me abhorrant names AND brought my mother and father into it. I do sparkle thank you. I also thank you for confirming that you HAVE been here playing sock puppet. Another term for you to look up.
    Regardless, you’ve been highly entertaining which is more than I can say for some in this thread.

    For your info, i was raised part time as an athiest, other times under the tutaledge of Christian Fanatics. yet I always felt the presence of what some may call god. I began studying religions at the age of six, I have read the Rig Veda as well as several ancient Hindu texts. To be honest, the mysticism of the Vedics match very closely to the personal visions I have with regards to the nature of the universe, albiet coached in poetic terms rather than simply literal ones. I also study the Koran, the Bible, the Talmud and the Zohar. Not too mention the ancients.

    I have a well rounded understanding of religious thought, not because I stick to any particular dogma rather because nearly every system of religion I’ve so far been fortunate enough to study have common roots. For instance, did you know Enheduanna’s writings about her goddess Inanna resembles to a tee Kali Ma’s persona? Anthropologists are currently debating the origins of Enheduanna’s personal goddess and have linked Her to An Indian origin? Engeduanna was the inventor of the first person narrative somwhere about 4500 years ago. Her devotional hymns laid the format for all hymns up to modern times. Yet! If you study her poetry (as I have) you will recognize the poetic forms she used is reminiscent to the Brahamic poetry.

    What I’m trying to say here is Kali Ma is older than Hinduism, has spread all over the world and has been renamed by every group who’ve ever worshipped Her. In other words Dear friend, Kali belongs to everyone. Not just you or yours.

    Now I have a tea to finish and some packing to do.
    Cheers!

  74. 2009 September 25
    Amit permalink

    Cheers to you too!

    At last finally a post! which is calm enough. Thanks for that. The info you provided is interesting, good to find about your knowledge of vedas, havent you read atharvveda and yajurveda? they are also some well written scriptures. I revere your diverse knowledge about religion in totality. I didnt have any grudge against you, just that a picture was not felt suitable. Although it made difference.

    And I repeat; I am not Jaijeet or someone else, I am Amit Kumar, age 24 years, MBA , Mumbai. The computer I use is meant for many, and people have the habit of digging into history and finding out what others have read or searched. So thats not my fault.

    It was nice blogging with you.

    All the best for your vacation and all the best for your life……

    (You must be thinking; at last the demon is gone )

    Best Regards

    Amit

  75. 2009 September 26

    Amit?! Gah! A post which is calm enough? I have been MORE than calm and kind to you since you first dropped in here with an armfull of insults. Plus…. ahhh never mind.

    thanks for the reading suggestions. I’m sure I will enjoy them.

  76. 2009 October 21

    ma kali is the form of adi shakti that come to kill demons like the one we are facing in this blog….
    god will come to you as you desire as she is god and you are not you are allowed certain mistakes.. now how many I do’nt know soon you will see an end though as your pitcher of sins looks full ok do some more of it and die get a better form or leave all forms and become one with the god….

  77. 2009 October 24
    Neeraj permalink

    Dear Hazel

    Surfing through net on an idyllic evening I just felt the urge to search up on Durga. Googling, I came across a cartoon image of her. My first thoughts- so those cries of hindu gods and godesses being depicted in a derogatory manner are indeed correct!

    Following the link I landed on your blog coz i just wanted to see who is the “Satan” here? Well, I must say i was really impressed by your blog but felt uneasy with the cartoon. I wasnt even thinking of posting this comment till I read the entire debate that has followed. I felt that matters ought to be seen in right perspective.

    You clearly write the image is not yours or that of Kali. I really gave notice to whats in her right hand only after I read about it in the comments. The one thing that bothered me as a normal guy born in India and following Hinduism was the caricature depiction.

    Questions like your fault or not, Kali should be dressed or naked when depicted in human form, individual liberties, death threats et al – irrespective of all these factors I feel the solitary reason for this image attracting ire is that Google now associates it with Kali and its a cartoon which looks not sincere but in jest. Im not a overtly religious person and in fact avoid ritualism and temple visits etc and yet I first felt anger and shock before going through your article in full.

    I admire and respect your interest in religion, especially hindu mythology and the way you have drawn parallels with cosmic events. I may or may not follow your blog further or maybe even others’ on the subject but have to tell you I liked what was written except for that cartoon. Its not ’sincere’ but it looks like Kali and thats why it appears all the more derogatory to Kali.

    Phew! now that I’ve expressed myself to you, im moving onto follow up links.

    Neeraj

    PS: An unsolicited advise- Keep up the good work and leave the tasteless, insincere, irreverent or disrespectful out unless relevant to context.

    Neeraj

  78. 2009 November 9

    dear Neeraj, thank you for your thoughtful comments. I’ll consider looking into this google issue, see what I can do to disasociate the image from the search term Kali.

  79. 2009 November 9

    Dear MS, Hell, heaven, divine retribution, Grace and intervention… its all here, right now.
    Jmho

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